The Orville

Non Star Trek: Star Wars, Firefly, BSG, Babylon 5, Stargate, etc.

Moderator: Dancyer McCoy

Forum rules
For those who haven't noticed the Forum Rules have been revised. It might be a good idea to take a look at them if you haven't read them for awhile. You'll find them in the Forum Rules forum at the top of the index page.
User avatar
JaceRidley
-The Captain-
-The Captain-
Posts: 1688
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 3:16 pm

Re: The Orville

Post by JaceRidley » Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:10 pm

Gazomg wrote:
Mon Feb 11, 2019 2:31 pm
JM1776 wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:10 pm

it's that much a pastiche of The Next Generation.
Up to date with this season now and the last episode where the doc falls in love with the android was like a rehash of so many tng episodes.

or the android human relationship
Sums up my entire problem with the show.

It's a fine show.

But I've seen it before.

JM1776
Federation Ambassador
Federation Ambassador
Posts: 13844
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:27 pm
Location: Pennsyltucky
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by JM1776 » Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:01 pm

Well, as Terence wrote, 2,000-odd years ago, "Nothing has been said that has not been said before."

It's not entirely factual ... but it has an air of truth to it.
"If CBS thinks I am going to pay to watch Star Trek, they are demented." – Marina Sirtis

User avatar
captainuniverse
Federation Attaché
Federation Attaché
Posts: 7348
Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:29 pm
Location: Washington State
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by captainuniverse » Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:49 am

I was watching the latest Orville episode last night and I must confess, I get like the Kaylons were like the Borg or the Replicators from Stargate: SG-1. In some ways, I felt like I was watching ‘Best of Both Worlds’ again.

What do you guys think?
"All of Time and Space; everywhere and anywhere; every star that ever was. Where do you want to start?"

"Geronimo!"

Thanks to FltCpt. Bossco for my Tattok avatar. This is Tattok when he assumed the position of Commander-in-Chief, Starfleet in the year 2411.

User avatar
Gazomg
Commodore
Commodore
Posts: 2061
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2010 1:11 am
Location: The Emerald Isle
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by Gazomg » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:27 am

enjoyed it a lot.

However had I known it was going to be a 2 parter before watching I would have waited and watched both episodes back to back
Image
MANIPULATIONS ON MY SITE - 2,296 - APRIL 24th

JM1776
Federation Ambassador
Federation Ambassador
Posts: 13844
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:27 pm
Location: Pennsyltucky
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by JM1776 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:33 pm

Spoiler:
I thought Isaac's motives apparent from the first scene in which it appeared. I'm fairly certain many of the most discerning viewers did, too. (In a way, Isaac is more believable than Data, who never seemed devoid of emotion.) Did Mercer and the Union think it was beginning its reports with, "Dear Diary" ... ?
Oddly enough, moments from the music in that episode's final scene reminded of the original Lost in Space.

I care about these people more than I do the crew of Discovery, and it's not even close.

On the other hand, if I never saw another episode of either series, I'd feel no great loss.
"If CBS thinks I am going to pay to watch Star Trek, they are demented." – Marina Sirtis

User avatar
amehatrekkie
-the weird one-
-the weird one-
Posts: 10548
Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:53 pm
Location: Earth, North American Continent, Southeast USA

Re: The Orville

Post by amehatrekkie » Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:52 pm

I consider Orville closer to trek than disc
Ahmie K-[ay][aka Adam Kriegel], Captain of the Department of Weird yea i'm weird
STPMA WORLDBUILDING EXPERT[ RIP MJ!!] Normal people scare meAging is inevitable, maturity is optional
https://imgur.com/a/bUvNm

User avatar
sirus
Lieutenant
Lieutenant
Posts: 622
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2009 2:21 am
Location: In a van by the river, stealing your wi-fi

Re: The Orville

Post by sirus » Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:22 am

amehatrekkie wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:52 pm
I consider Orville closer to trek than disc
I think a lot of people do. Orville is closer in tone and pacing to what is now commonly called "Nostalgia Trek" and seems to be made by the same people who made said trek. Discovery has an almost completely brand new team of writers and people behind the scenes with only a few notable exceptions. he new "Picard show" appears to already have the same problem.
From ignorance lead me to truth
From darkness lead me to light
From death lead me to immortality

ryjuda.deviantart.com

User avatar
Bry_Sinclair
Fleet Captain
Fleet Captain
Posts: 1909
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2006 1:53 am
Location: Lerwick, Shetland, Scotland

Re: The Orville

Post by Bry_Sinclair » Fri Apr 19, 2019 11:20 am

sirus wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 12:22 am
he new "Picard show" appears to already have the same problem.
After 'Discovery', I am dreading the new Picard show. I've set my expectations low and will not be pinning any hopes for the future of the franchise on it. I can only hope Sir Patrick has enough affections for the fandom and clout to make sure that the show doesn't end up an utter travesty.
Avatar: Captain Reihyn, Commanding Officer, U.S.S. Orion (circa 2375)
Artist: FltCpt. Bossco

User avatar
JaceRidley
-The Captain-
-The Captain-
Posts: 1688
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 3:16 pm

Re: The Orville

Post by JaceRidley » Fri Apr 19, 2019 8:29 pm

Nostalgia Trek is a good name for it. It sums it up PERFECTLY.

"a sentimental longing or wistful affection for the past, typically for a period or place with happy personal associations."

Resistant to change. Resistant to progress. Resistant to anything that might tread on that idea of what it should be based on what it was.
Literally everything wrong with fiction.

Any writer worth their salt knows that complacency is the enemy.

JM1776
Federation Ambassador
Federation Ambassador
Posts: 13844
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:27 pm
Location: Pennsyltucky
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by JM1776 » Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:27 am

"It doesn't feel like Trek to me" is a legitimate criticism, whether newer fans like that or not.

But the locus of that sentence is "to me".

"Stop expecting our standards to conform to yours", however, is a legitimate counter-argument to that criticism. It's not satisfying to the old guard, of which I am a card-carrying member at times, but it's valid.

The problem I see is that the old school cannot accept that ... no pun intended ... the next generation doesn't feel bound to honor (or even respect) what their forebears felt was somehow sacred, while the avant-garde sometimes falls into "change for change's sake" and on occasion throws out the baby (Klingon) with the bath(leth) water.

I like The Orville. In some ways, I like it more than Discovery, for the reasons above and others far subtler and nuanced. But it's so much a pastiche of Star Trek: The Next Generation that Paramount, in my opinion, could absolutely have stopped it in its tracks with a lawsuit if they'd wanted to do so. (And yes, I've read an attorney or two [including our much-respected LStyer] asserting otherwise, but I've also read lawyers agreeing with me, so ... let's not go there in this conversation.)

But perhaps they realized, in what constitutes from my perspective a stunning display of maturity and farsightedness, that letting both The Orville and Discovery have their audiences satisfies more people than condemning either does.

I once watched Siskel and Ebert debate the merits of a Godzilla film from the Showa period. Gene, God rest his soul, attended church at Our Lady of Just Don't Get It. He went on for a time about all the obvious flaws of such a film, while Ebert waited patiently. When his counterpart was done, Roger shook his head and said something to the effect of, "Gene ... this is not supposed to be Olivier in Othello. If a film sets out to do something, and succeeds, it's a good film. I don't go to see Godzilla movies for high theater. I go to see Godzilla show up and kick the crap out of another monster that's threatening the Earth. That happens in this movie. Most kids and some people who are kids at heart will like this film. THUMBS UP."

You're not morally superior if you prefer The Orville to Star Trek: Discovery.

You're not more evolved if you prefer Star Trek: Discovery to The Orville.

If you believe either, you're a pretentious ass.

One man's brilliance is another man's blasphemy.
"If CBS thinks I am going to pay to watch Star Trek, they are demented." – Marina Sirtis

User avatar
JaceRidley
-The Captain-
-The Captain-
Posts: 1688
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 3:16 pm

Re: The Orville

Post by JaceRidley » Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:29 am

Joe, at no point did I say any of that and you know it.

I have no real problems with The Orville. It's not MY thing because as I said... I've already seen the show in the 90s when it was actually called Star Trek. But I don't care if others like it. My son loves it. Thankfully, he also loves Discovery.

What I said was that the resistance to Discovery, and the "Nostalgia Trek" movement, and the way people talk about it like Discovery is some affront to their sensibilities.... is ridiculous.

Just because it's new, and different, and not the same old, same old, "Nostalgia Trek"ers act like Discovery is anathema to everything Trek..... when it's not. But they lap up the Orville, which is the same damn show with the same damn plots(literally) that have been in trek for 30 years.

Hell, Star Trek Online tells better original stories than The Orville in my opinion.

People can still like and watch the Orville... Go for it.

But it is not now nor will it ever be Star Trek in any way except as a love letter to the past. Star Trek is about the human race progressing forward. Always striving for the NEXT goal. The NEXT, heh, Discovery. It's DEEPLY disappointing to me that given that fundamental truth of trek that so many people who call themselves fans are happy with complacency, story rehashes, and keeping things the same because "New and Different is Scary"...

JM1776
Federation Ambassador
Federation Ambassador
Posts: 13844
Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 4:27 pm
Location: Pennsyltucky
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by JM1776 » Sat Apr 20, 2019 5:06 pm

JaceRidley wrote: Joe, at no point did I say any of that and you know it.
At no point did I say that post was directed at you, and you know it.

You, sirus and Gazomg are not the only people with whom I discuss this topic, and I have no doubt my other conversations color my statements here, too.

My post, however, stands or falls on its own merits ... and I stand by everything I said.
"If CBS thinks I am going to pay to watch Star Trek, they are demented." – Marina Sirtis

User avatar
Gazomg
Commodore
Commodore
Posts: 2061
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2010 1:11 am
Location: The Emerald Isle
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by Gazomg » Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:37 pm

my own personal feeling is that the orville is very trek tng like, but will never call it trek simply because its not trek regardless of what others try to dictate.
trek is what the producers and makers of trek say is trek, whether we agree or not.
That abrams shit is trek and as much as i despised those movies its something that we have to accept, liking it or not is our choice.

I like the orville, and outside of trek dont watch sci fi, never seen star wars, etc, and orville is one of those shows where the premise appeals to me, and I like it as it is.,,,,the orville.
Image
MANIPULATIONS ON MY SITE - 2,296 - APRIL 24th

User avatar
Michael
Senior Admin
Senior Admin
Posts: 12747
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 10:32 pm
Location: North of the North Pole
Contact:

Re: The Orville

Post by Michael » Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:29 am

JM1776 wrote:
Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:27 am
I once watched Siskel and Ebert debate the merits of a Godzilla film from the Showa period. Gene, God rest his soul, attended church at Our Lady of Just Don't Get It. He went on for a time about all the obvious flaws of such a film, while Ebert waited patiently. When his counterpart was done, Roger shook his head and said something to the effect of, "Gene ... this is not supposed to be Olivier in Othello. If a film sets out to do something, and succeeds, it's a good film. I don't go to see Godzilla movies for high theater. I go to see Godzilla show up and kick the crap out of another monster that's threatening the Earth. That happens in this movie. Most kids and some people who are kids at heart will like this film. THUMBS UP."

You're not morally superior if you prefer The Orville to Star Trek: Discovery.

You're not more evolved if you prefer Star Trek: Discovery to The Orville.
I agree.
-Michael Gray
Image
"In Great Deeds Something Abides"

Post Reply