Which Series?

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LStyer
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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:14 am

Triton wrote:LStyer, have you drawn up any campaign scenarios?
I had plans once for a TOS game set along the Klingon frontier around the time of the Organian Peace Treaty. Mixed in with standalone episodes, I wanted to have some Klingon encounters both before and after the treaty, moving from hot war to cold war. I particularly wanted to play around with a Klingon defector. This would have been about 90% TOS "pure," so I was planning to pretty much ignore anything revealed in the later series unless it really grabbed me for some reason.

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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:20 am

Quo wrote:I would think that Voyager would be very limiting to any game where you actually 'wanted' to be a member of 'Fleet (or even the Maquis). There is only ONE ship, ONE command crew, and that's it. You almost HAVE to use canon characters because of it.
When I think of RPing the Voyager premise, I was really just thinking more along the lines of "Starfleet ship stuck far away without support" angle, not so much "U.S.S. Voyager stuck far away without support."

Then again, when I RP in a media property I don't tend to feel constrained by the cannon events in the property that come after the point where my campaign starts. It's usually more about using the setting than it is using the events.

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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Fri Feb 11, 2011 3:26 pm

LStyer wrote:
Triton wrote:LStyer, have you drawn up any campaign scenarios?
I had plans once for a TOS game set along the Klingon frontier around the time of the Organian Peace Treaty. Mixed in with standalone episodes, I wanted to have some Klingon encounters both before and after the treaty, moving from hot war to cold war. I particularly wanted to play around with a Klingon defector. This would have been about 90% TOS "pure," so I was planning to pretty much ignore anything revealed in the later series unless it really grabbed me for some reason.
Interesting scenario. I can understand wanting to make it about 90% TOS "pure".
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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:31 pm

Triton wrote:Interesting scenario. I can understand wanting to make it about 90% TOS "pure".
Based on your avatar, I'm not totally surprised.

I like both TOS and TNG-era Star Trek, but I don't think they really fit together all that well, and I'm more partial to the setting as portrayed in TOS. The characterization of TOS Klingons holds a lot more appeal to me than the TNG Viking/Samurai Klingons. I even prefer the original makeup scheme, though I have to admit that's probably just a sentimental preference. If I used the "bumpy" Klingons at all, I'd almost certainly ignore the Augment virus explanation and posit two separate racial/ethnic groups of Klingons. There might even be room for some TNG-characterization Klingons, though they'd not be culturally dominant considering what we saw in TOS.

On the other hand, I'd probably go ahead and pick up the Enterprise portrayal of Andorians since they were largely undeveloped by TOS but look so darn cool, and the idea of a history of conflict between the Andorians and the Vulcans seems like it might provide some RP opportunities.

Germane to this board, I find TOS uniforms and costumes more visually interesting than TNG and, especially DS9 and First Contact uniforms and costumes, and since I like having photomanips for characters in my games, that's just another point in favor of TOS

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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Sat Feb 12, 2011 3:58 pm

I may be biased to Star Trek: The Original Series because my first introduction to the Star Trek universe was Star Trek: The Animated Series. Then came Star Trek: The Motion Picture and then after I watched Star Trek: The Original Series for the first time in syndication. (Or it was the first time that I can remember watching them.) But I am not inclined to alter and revise the Star Trek: The Original series universe to make it compatible with the changes made in Star Trek: The Next Generation and the retconning that occurred in Star Trek: Enterprise. Some of these changes seem contrary to the artistic intentions of their original creators.

My take on the canon versus apocrypha argument is that there is good precedent and bad precedent. That we should be able to use judgment regarding the precedent we are going to acknowledge in our derivative works and RPG campaigns and chose precedent that it true to the artistic integrity of the original work.

I also love the fandom materials written by Michael Morrissette, Todd Guenther, and Aridas Sofia/David J Nielsen that attempted to fill in the gaps of the continuity during the Dark Ages when very little Star Trek material was published. Plus we have that goodness from Franz Joseph and FASA from their Star Trek Role Playing Game. I prefer to use the Chuck Graham/Geoffrey Mandel Timeline for the TOS/Movie Era to the Star Trek Chronology devised by Michael and Denise Okuda.
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Re: Which Series?

Post by Jono » Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:32 pm

Minor point but as much as I think the Augment story wasn't the greatest it is Canon, as is the fact Kahless had a bumpy head as did many other Klingons in the Hall of Warriors (as seen in DS9) so we can draw a fairly conclusive line of reasoning of what happened and the Augment story does fit (obviously as it was designed to do so) and the two species or genomes theory doesn't hold true due to three Klingons, Kor, Kang and Koloth. There's also an argument for General Chang as his ridges were rather less pronounced.

To me it seems like a lot of effort to ignore parts of the official background and having GM'd RPG groups as well I know some creative license is needed but omitting things like this can cause confusion for those who actually know the subject matter?

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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:05 pm

Jono wrote:Minor point but as much as I think the Augment story wasn't the greatest it is Canon, as is the fact Kahless had a bumpy head as did many other Klingons in the Hall of Warriors (as seen in DS9) so we can draw a fairly conclusive line of reasoning of what happened and the Augment story does fit (obviously as it was designed to do so) and the two species or genomes theory doesn't hold true due to three Klingons, Kor, Kang and Koloth. There's also an argument for General Chang as his ridges were rather less pronounced.

To me it seems like a lot of effort to ignore parts of the official background and having GM'd RPG groups as well I know some creative license is needed but omitting things like this can cause confusion for those who actually know the subject matter?
The issue I have is not with the change of appearance of the Klingons from Star Trek: The Original Series, to Star Trek: The Motion Picture, to Star Trek: The Next Generation and then Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country, the issue I have is that I believe that the Klingon culture has changed over time. TOS Klingons do not favor long swords to disruptors, sing songs of glorious battles, or drink blood wine. I don't believe that Kor the Dahar Master portrayed in Star Trek: Deep Space Nine would use a machine as dishonorable as the mind-sifter used in "Errand of Mercy." You might disagree with this observation. But I would rather play in the Star Trek: The Original Series universe the way it is depicted on screen than revise it so that it fits in with the movies and television series that followed it.
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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:17 am

Jono wrote:Minor point but as much as I think the Augment story wasn't the greatest it is Canon
Oh, I realize that. I just don't care. I didn't care for the explanation so I'll ignore it.
There's also an argument for General Chang as his ridges were rather less pronounced.
Or Chang could be a hybrid between the two Klingon subspecies, so he fits right into "two subspecies" explanation.
To me it seems like a lot of effort to ignore parts of the official background and having GM'd RPG groups as well I know some creative license is needed but omitting things like this can cause confusion for those who actually know the subject matter?
It would probably be more effort than it's worth in a TNG or Enterprise era game because a lot of this stuff is woven into the background of the setting as-portrayed in the source material at that point. A TOS game would be a different matter, though, I think, because this stuff wasn't even there to have been woven into background and, in some cases, doesn't really fit anyway. I figure for a TOS game, you could just say "We're playing in the Trek universe as portrayed in TOS, so if something comes from a later series, assume it doesn't count unless we decide otherwise."

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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:24 am

Triton wrote:I may be biased to Star Trek: The Original Series because my first introduction to the Star Trek universe was Star Trek: The Animated Series.
I may be biased in favor of TOS cause it kicks ass. That said, the first exposure to Trek that I can specifically remember were the post TMP Kirk-era movies followed by TOS in syndication.
That we should be able to use judgment regarding the precedent we are going to acknowledge in our derivative works and RPG campaigns and chose precedent that it true to the artistic integrity of the original work.
In a gaming context, I aim for using enough of the background to pick up the "feel" of the source property, and then shift my focus to making it a fun game, specific events in the source material be damned. If I'm running a Star Wars campaign and events conspire to have my PCs blow up the Death Star before the events of the first movie, that's fine because playing a bunch of second fiddles usually isn't any fun anyhow.
I also love the fandom materials written by Michael Morrissette, Todd Guenther, and Aridas Sofia/David J Nielsen that attempted to fill in the gaps of the continuity during the Dark Ages when very little Star Trek material was published.
I'm not sure i know that stuff. Can you give me some pointers?

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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:35 pm

LStyer wrote:
Triton wrote:I also love the fandom materials written by Michael Morrissette, Todd Guenther, and Aridas Sofia/David J Nielsen that attempted to fill in the gaps of the continuity during the Dark Ages when very little Star Trek material was published.
I'm not sure i know that stuff. Can you give me some pointers?
Some of the technical drawings from the Federation Reference Series and Starship Design: The Interstellar Forum for Naval Power can be found on the Star Trek LCARS Blueprint Database web site at:
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/bl ... -main2.php

The fan presses that produced the technical fandom material included the Star Fleet Printing (SFPO), Starstation Aurora, and Starfleet Dynamics.
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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:39 pm

I also presume that you are familiar with the works of Masao Okazaki at the Starfleet Museum at:
http://www.starfleet-museum.org/

Statistics for the FASA Star Trek Role Playing Game have been created for these designs, and others, at Vintage Starships II at:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/steven.bac ... rships.htm

I don't know if you are using the Last Unicorn Games ICON, Decipher CODA, Amarillo Design Bureau Prime Directive, D20, or another RPG rule system for your Star Trek RPG campaign. I believe that there are sites on the web and fan-produced materials that allow you to more easily convert equipment, vehicles, and characters among the multiple Star Trek role-playing game systems.
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Re: Which Series?

Post by LStyer » Sun Feb 13, 2011 5:49 pm

Triton wrote:I also presume that you are familiar with the works of Masao Okazaki at the Starfleet Museum at:
http://www.starfleet-museum.org/
Yeah, I've seen that site. It rules.
I don't know if you are using . . . for your Star Trek RPG campaign.
When I play, we usually use the Decipher CODA system. When I run the game, we use a sort-of dumbed-down variant on FASA.

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Re: Which Series?

Post by amehatrekkie » Sun Feb 13, 2011 6:02 pm

i love the LCARS and museum sites...they're well done
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Re: Which Series?

Post by Triton » Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:33 pm

Jono wrote:To me it seems like a lot of effort to ignore parts of the official background and having GM'd RPG groups as well I know some creative license is needed but omitting things like this can cause confusion for those who actually know the subject matter?
Perhaps the best way to handle this issue is to inform the players of how the Star Trek: The Original Series universe is going to be interpreted and to verify their agreement to this interpretation prior to the commencing the RPG campaign.
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Re: Which Series?

Post by rojblake » Thu May 12, 2011 8:09 pm

I generally use TOS through Trek IV or so, its got the richest background, material, & strangely...freedom of movement.

TNG had to create new villians & either altered or pacified the old ones.

Klingons are more fun as foils than friends, by the time of TNG/DS9 the Cardassians have largely become irrealevant unless your doing a Maquis campaign.

I would actually like MORE info on the Cardassians, a game set during those years might be fun.

The Borg stories were pretty much covered.

The other problem in TNG/DS9 terms is that so much of the Alpha quadrant has been tamed...which actually helps a later TOS/Movie campaign.

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